Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Muzzle and breech loading black powder firearms. Military and sporting.
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Niner Delta
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Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby Niner Delta » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:45 pm

Ok..yes... I did what I never thought I would do.... buy a black powder pistol.
It's a Lyman Remington New Army 1858 44 cal. reproduction made in Italy in 1973 by
Armi San Paolo (later Euroarms). As you can see in the photos it came with holster and belt,
some balls and caps, felt plug thingies, powder measure thing, and a unopened 1 lb jar
of Hodgdon Pyrodex P.
It seems to be in vg shape and all the mechanics are tight and smooth, although there was a
little surface rust inside the barrel and a couple of very light pits.
On Amazon I ordered the Lyman Black Powder Handbook & Loading Manual, 2nd Edition, for the
princely sum of $23.35, maybe I'll learn something. Will also be picking all your brains to find out
what actually works and what doesn't.
Now all I have to do figure out what to do with all this stuff......and if I never figure it out,
I only paid $60 for everything, so I won't be out much..... :mrgreen:

.

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:USA:

Peace is that brief, quiet moment in history.......... when everybody stands around reloading.
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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby Niner » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:57 pm

If you paid $60 for all of that in the photo you did real good. Those wonder wads are used in place of a lot of grease to prevent chain fires. The 1858 is one of the strongest designs and should be a great shooter.
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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby DuncaninFrance » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:11 am

When I had my 1858 (Pietta) I found the 2 things of most help were a bench loader and larger hand grips ( both made myself)

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The bench loader make it much easier to load a consistant pressure and it also makes it much easier to mount the caps.
The hand grips on my Pietta, as you can see, were too short for my spade hands. Once replaced I found my shooting improved no end - I could actually HIT the barn door :lol: :lol:
Duncan

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"Many of those who enjoy freedom know little of its price."
You can't fix Stupid, but you can occasionally head it off before it hurts something.

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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby joseyclosey » Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:40 am

Blimey, wish I could find something like that for 60 quid. Once you get the hang of it they're great fun Vern. :D
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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby Niner » Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:45 am

You can speed up the loading if you had a flask and the right size spout for the load you are going to be using. What you see in the photo is a 20 grain spout. They come multiple sizes. With the powder in the flask and the right size spout screwed in, you invert the flask with your finger over the end of the spout to keep the powder in, and hit the spring that opens the door into the powder, fill the spout, release the spring door catch, bring the flask to upright, pour powder into long measure and pour into gun chamber. I skip the long measure step and load directly into the revolver chambers when the pistol is cold but it would be a good safety measure to not skip the intermediate step.

BP and Pyrodex are measured by volume and not weight. That's why the measure spouts and tube measure are safe to use. Duncan, on the on the other hand has a more expansive load measuring system and theory which he will explain...or has explained in another post years back.

Another thing crosses my mind.... you might need a capper magazine if you don't have one. Otherwise fitting the caps on with your fingers is more of a struggle. There are some side load cappers but avoid them for the straight line version like the one I'm adding to the images.

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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby Aughnanure » Sun Aug 12, 2018 12:24 pm

Welcome to that great fraternity where "The hickory ramrod hath charm and the smell of black powder is sweet".
Self Defence is not only a Right, it is an Obligation.

Eoin.
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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby DuncaninFrance » Sun Aug 12, 2018 2:27 pm

Personally I wouldn't bother with a caper and I would not use a flask.
Contrary to general belief powder is measured in grains and that is a measure of weight not volume..........
1 grain = 0.000142857 lbs / 0.06479891 grams.
I always measured my charges into plastic tubes BEFORE going to the range so my charges were always consistant.
I never used lube over the mouths of the cylinder either. I used to cast .457 lead balls and that was a tight enough fit to leave a small ring of lead once the ball was loaded.
All that lube over the front of the chambers does is leave a load of shit over the gun.
Chain fires are caused by poor fitting balls and/or loose percussion caps.
Duncan

What contemptible scoundrel has stolen the cork to my lunch? -- W.C. Fields
"Many of those who enjoy freedom know little of its price."
You can't fix Stupid, but you can occasionally head it off before it hurts something.

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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby Niner » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:34 pm

Chain fires are more often..so I have read....caused by percussion caps coming off the nipple in adjoining chambers to one discharging than through the front end. However, If the percussion cap seems loose on the nipple squeeze the edge of the cap slightly and it will grip the nipple better. Even if a cap comes off while firing another chamber it isn't anything to get into a panic about...it's happened to me in the past without any chain fire and on more than one occasion. I've never had, nor have I ever seen, a chain fire. It's not something to get too concerned about if you use common sense and load correctly.

I like the wads and don't use the grease either...the wads go between the ball and the powder. The ball just has to fit tight in my estimation, you don't need to produce a lead ring cut off. Just use the size ball recommended by the manufacturer. Not all .44 cal reproductions use the exact same ball diameter.

You can weigh all of your powder, but there is no discernable difference in results over a powder measure....according to Sam Fadala.

As anybody reading this will surmise, it's all like home cooking and everybody has his own recipe.

Just read the book you ordered, Vern.
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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby DuncaninFrance » Sun Aug 12, 2018 4:18 pm

Duncan

What contemptible scoundrel has stolen the cork to my lunch? -- W.C. Fields
"Many of those who enjoy freedom know little of its price."
You can't fix Stupid, but you can occasionally head it off before it hurts something.

http://www.twgpp.org
http://www.andrewsinfrance.co.uk
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Re: Armi San Paolo Remington 1858 New Army

Postby Niner » Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:08 pm

Well...this is a friendly discussion and I remain unconvinced of your point of view that weighing a BP load serves any added value over a thrown powder load. I follow the BP guru Sam Fadala. At least in his book he offers an explanation that suggests he did some empirical tests before he came to his assertions about how a supposed benefit with weighed loads is imaginary.

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