1919 Ishapore makings

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smle cat
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1919 Ishapore makings

Postby smle cat » Sun Aug 08, 2010 9:55 am

Hi everyone! I'm new to this forum, hope to chat with some of you and learn some new facts about milsurp's with the forum topics. I have some pics of markings on an Ishapore (1919) I am trying to find out they're meaning. Any help is appreciated, here's pics of the markings plus other pics of parts of the rifle. Thanks.
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:)
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Niner
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby Niner » Sun Aug 08, 2010 10:28 am

Nice looking granade launcher version of the 1MKIII *. Took a glance at Stratton's book and looks like, according to him, Isaphore didn't make any MkIII's in 1919......shows1909 to 1916 and 1920 to 1936. Guess Isaphore was taking time off for WWI. Maybe the * model adjustment was an exception.

Looks like the bolt and receiver match as to numbers...that's good. Have you shot it?

You might want to look around for a granade cup. I understand you can shoot tennis balls out of it with blank rounds to launch them, although I have never tried it.

Here is a bit of trivia. The "I" added under the Crown on these rifles made in India stands for Imperator which is saying that the British monarch it was made during the time of was not just monarch of England but Emperor or Imperator of the British Empire.

Oh how the mighty have fallen.. :bigsmile:

Wonder why Bush or Obama didn't think of adding something like that to US arms since the US seems to be in charge of the world now days?
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DuncaninFrance
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby DuncaninFrance » Sun Aug 08, 2010 1:08 pm

Welcome. Not sure it is a good idea to shoot this if it was a grenade launcher :shock:
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Aughnanure
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby Aughnanure » Sun Aug 08, 2010 6:33 pm

Re. shooting EY rifles, as the designated Grenade Launcher rifles were known. They were serviceable rifles in every respect but strengthened for their special role by being wire wrapped to stop large splinters flying if they happened to burst their barrels. The EY rifleman used his rifle in combat as an orinary rifle and only attached the cup when necessary. If something untoward happened to the EY rifle then the cup went onto a rifle that wasn't wrapped, if the new EY rifleman was nervous and there was time the impressed rifle could be wrapped with pullthroughs.
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby Niner » Sun Aug 08, 2010 8:04 pm

I'm with Eoin. How would you like to be a new replacement just before going into battle and the squad leader says.... "Glad you are here, mate. You get the rifle that only launches granades or tennis balls. "

Sorry......couldn't resist the urge. :loco:

By the way, did anyone notice the date on that granade cup?
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Aughnanure
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby Aughnanure » Sun Aug 08, 2010 10:35 pm

1942, so it's wartime manufacture; they were still in use in the Australian Army al least up until the early 1960s.
Many Indian grenade launcher rifles, or as most call them 'wire wraps', that came onto the market had new or very good barrels.
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby Woftam » Mon Aug 09, 2010 5:37 am

Interesting markings. The ISH in ISHAPORE looks to have been restamped as does the first 1 in 1919. Wonder if the originals were worn ?
The Serial number is self explanatory. The M on the bolt head means a different specification in the metal used.
The RFI on the bolt handle is Rifle Factory Ishapore and likely an inspectors mark.
The 153 IT (or 1T) on the butt plate is an inspectors mark. The 74 I don't know.The cursive B on the rear of the action I've never seen before.

Just a couple of other things because I'm a pedantic bastard.
Imperator never stood for Emperor of the British Empire. It stood for Emperor of India. That is why GRI is found on Ishapore production only, not on British production.

Indian production was very convoluted with respect to models. The MkIII was produced from 1909 to 1918, the MkIII* was produced from 1917 to 1920. A second version of the MkIII was produced from 1920 to 1940 and a second version of the MkIII* from 1941 to 1952. A 1919 MkIII* with a B serial is consistant with this production according to Skennerton.
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby DuncaninFrance » Mon Aug 09, 2010 8:21 am

:shock: They were serviceable rifles in every respect but strengthened for their special role by being wire wrapped to stop large splinters flying if they happened to burst their barrels. :shock: I think I'll stay with my statement!!
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What contemptible scoundrel has stolen the cork to my lunch? -- W.C. Fields
"Many of those who enjoy freedom know little of its price."
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Niner
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby Niner » Mon Aug 09, 2010 8:24 am

Thanks Woftam, for correcting me on the emperor thing. Probably just misread the intent in the book. Your version makes more sense.
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Re: 1919 Ishapore makings

Postby brewstop » Mon Aug 09, 2010 10:53 am


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