Winchester P 14 in hand.

[Ed Novak]

Adam: I extend my apologies to anyone offended by my remarks regarding "true riflemen"; it was not my intent to appear elitist or parochial with regard to the "shooting sports". I have hunted deer, elk, moose, "upland game-birds", small game and varmints for many years and in some dozen U.S. states and Germany. I did not intend for my "true riflemen..." comment to reflect other than the perceived fact that here, in the U.S., there are "riflemen" who shoot paper with dedication; people who continuously purchase reloading products such as bullets, powders, primers, brass, manuals, dies, scales, gauges, case-trimmers, powder-dispensers, ad infinitum and financially support the rifle ranges and, perhaps, the entire shooting-sports industry, to some significant extent and who have a continuous dedication to marksmanship, as opposed to an annual hunting event with a well-placed shot or two. My dearest friend gets his deer every year with an ancient Winchester 25-35 and is using the last rounds out of a box of factory ammunition he probably purchased several years ago while I am handloading many hundreds of rounds of .303 ammunition year around and shooting holes in paper targets. He is a "hunter" and sees his rifle as a "hunting tool"; he thinks my activities non-productive (no meat on the table). I consider myself a "rifleman" and see my rifle(s), in and of themselves as challenges for shooting-perfection. Perspective, Adam, but I appreciated your comments. ed

<p></p><i>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p089.ezboard.com/bmilsurpafterho ... ednovak>Ed Novak</A> at: 11/16/04 7:34 pm

</i>

[dromia]

Hey Ed,





no need to apologise mate, there was no offence taken. I wasn't getting at you and your post at all and if it seemed like that then I apologise.





All I was trying to do was illustrate how easy it is for <!--EZCODE ITALIC START--><em><!--EZCODE BOLD START--><strong>all</strong><!--EZCODE BOLD END--></em><!--EZCODE ITALIC END--> us shooters to get absorbed in our own interests and forget to understand the others.





The consequences of this for us here in the UK were severe, I was just trying to make the general point that we all should remember respect each others enthusiasms as the antis wil exploit any divisions.





I wasn't suggesting Ed that you were doing that so sorry if thats how it seemed.





Hope this puts the record straight. ;







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Adam.





Why don't you visit .

[Ed Novak]

Adam: I am locally known as a curmudgeon and there are occasions when myself gets the upper hand. I've e-mailed you a message explaining the reasons for which I let my persona "leak out onto the forum". Like you, I appreciate game-hunting, at its fairest aspect.


I've been a "shooter" for some 40 years now. Sincerely enjoy paper targets these days - I don't need to rise early, the targets hold perfectly still and they are easily "field-dressed".


Still, I await the reopening of my club's rifle range this next week so that I can test the P14.


Adam: "Blessed are the peacemakers...". Thanks, sincerely, for the personal message. ed

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[dromia]

Thanks for the email and your post Ed.





I reply to you direct in due course.





Nowt wrong with curmudgeons being one myself. ;





I've never regreted anything I've said but I've often times regreted not saying what I've thought.





Don't worry about your persona "leaking" onto the site, thats what I like about here, its the nearest I get to "people" on the netty.





When I was given the opportunity to Moderate this forum by Robert I wanted it to be more than just a question and answer board, see the welcome sticky at the top of the forum.





I wanted it to try and express the passion and enthusiasm that fine firearms and the art of shooting, in all its facets, can arouse in us.





So a robust adult debate is what we want here, tempered with some serious crack and leg pulling. We can always agree to disagree if neeeds be and have some fun in the process.





We are what we are and life is good but all too short, however honesty, integrity, respect and humility will make the most of what we've got, so..................





Curmudgeon away I say! ;







<p>http://www.photobucket.com/albums/1003/ ... _Badge.gif" style="border:0;"/><!--EZCODE IMAGE END-->





Adam.





Why don't you visit .

[A square 10]

reading with interest gentlemen , a couple comments , ed- let yourself "leak out" adds a human quality to someone ive yet to meet and this media is all too good at hiding our humanity , im proud to wear that curmudgeon lable amongst my family as im in good company - inspite of being into my second half century i get the "young" lable as the general gets the "old" and the recently gone "commander" had the "no prefix" , we all anjoyed each others company . i too support all shooting enthusiasts and appreciate the deer reduction as the critters are way too common these days , and in light of the recent shooting incident in our neighboring state i think we will need to brace ourselves for a renewed assalt on our ownership rights , its a shame but the SKS will get as much blame in the media as the sick individual who committed the crime , and as long as im ranting here - since the blue state eleitists have stated that they are more intelligent than us bumbling red state flyover folks how is it that they blame inanntimate objects for the actions of people ? oh yea , thats right , they have an agenda

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[Ed Novak]

A square: Indeed, the hunting/shooting fraternity has already come "under fire" from MN Public Radio, to wit "Assault rifle used in the slaying of 6 Wisconsin hunters...". I wonder when the "state" will provide current cartography to accurately depict "public v. private" landholdings for those seeking public land to hunt on without incurring bullying behavior by individuals claiming it to be private/leased land? Law enforcement, including the Department of Natural Resources Conservation Officers seem to have no interest in disputes unless someone is injured. Wisconsin hunters have been quoted as saying "The fun has gone out of deer hunting for this year" - I daresay that the fun went out of deer hunting long ago for many who have been unable to obtain accurate information about land available to the "public" for hunting and who have been denied legal access. It is unfortunate that this incident may be an impetus for law enforcement/state government to look again at land-use entitlement. I don't know the "shooter's" reason for his actions; I can only think that he was threatened or felt shame beyond his ability to act reasonably. ed




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[Niner]

<!--EZCODE QUOTE START--><blockquote><strong><em>Quote:</em></strong><hr>. I don't know the "shooter's" reason for his actions; I can only think that he was threatened or felt shame beyond his ability to act reasonably.<hr></blockquote><!--EZCODE QUOTE END-->





Ed, there is no excuse for killing people.

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[Ed Novak]

Niner: I absolutely agree; there is no excuse for killing people. I was not looking for an excuse; "we" hunters and shooters are seeking a "reason" for which this tradgedy ocurred. Behavior modification can arise from knowledge.


I will desist on this subject and turn my interest back to "things Enfield" wrt this forum. ed




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[Niner]

You're right Ed, I guess I was just stating the obvious. Sometimes my fingers are in motion before my brain is actually in gear. <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START : --><img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/ohwell.gif ALT=":">;

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[A square 10]

late to the table , i fear the spinmeisters on both sides of this tragic story will do only harm to those of us who hold arms , agree about MPR-it was immeadiate report that there were ASSUALT rifles involved as if that could CAUSE someone to shoot another , agree about the land use discussions with the exception that one of my office mates hunts that area and has quite good books to delineate the ownership/access information its just that one must invest the time to study and plan his hunt and some out there wont , last but not least i find it impossible to justify pointing the rifle at one another let alone shooting no matter what the circumstances and im pointing that comment at whoever "pointed" first - this should never have happened

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