Milsurp After Hours

Duncan

In my neck of the woods, you have to be a member of a club for at least a year before you can apply for a rifle or handgun. You have to regularly attend during that year, and it is usual that you have to pass a safety course, before a club official will give you a letter to apply for a firearm. In certain circumstances the club official can forego the year waiting period, ie if you have previous experience with firearms, eg former Police or Military training. You then put a deposit on the firearm you want and submit an application to the Police Firearms Branch. This application must be accompanied by the letter from the club official, a receipt from the dealer you are buying the firearm from showing the serial number, make, model and calibre of the firearm. You must also have two referees, who have to complete a form re your background and on your suitability to possess a firearm. The referees are supposed to send these forms in to the Firearms Branch yourself. The Police then start to process your application. At the minute there is a huge backlog, and I have known people who have waited a year for their licence to come back. Not good!!!!!

Whilst processing your application, the Police carry out backgound checks on the applicant, and you eventually get a visit from a local Firearms Enquiry Officer, who will ask you more questions re your background etc. After all this is done and you are lucky, Firearms Branch will send you a letter stating that your application has been approved on condition you get an approved gun cabinet installed in your home. You are usually given a few weeks to do this, then the Firearms Enquiry Officer will visit your home again to inspect your cabinet. If he is satisfied, he will send a report to Firearms Branch and you will receive your Firearm Licence in the post.

It is usual that you are allowed to have 500 rounds for each firearm on your licence. I have a 7.65mm pistol and can lawfully possess 500 rounds of ammunition for it at any one time. I could buy 500 rounds today, and as long as I fired them off, I could go and buy another 500 rounds tomorrow. Obviously this could easily lead to me having more then my allowance, but if the local Firearms Enquiry Officer does a spot check and finds that I have more ammunition than my allowance, it could lead to my Firearms Licence being revoked.

Each time I buy another firearm, I have to submit another application to have it put on my licence including another letter from the Club Official. This is known as a variation, and you will be visited by the Firearms Enquiry Officer again. You must show good reason for possesion of each firearm. This is a real pain in the butt, because you could have to wait up to a year for it to come back again.

This is a very quick run down on what we have to do to get a Firearms Licence. I have omitted some details for fear of boring you senseless!!!!! For instance, Firearms Branch may check your medical history. Having a criminal record may stop you getting a Licence, depending of course on the offence. If you are involved in any incidents of Assault or Domestic Violence, your Firearms will usually be seized by the Police, and you probably wont get them back, again depending on the circumstances. Obviously their is a slightly different procedure if you want a firearm for vermin control, shooting pheasants or deer stalking.

Ian

I find it interesting all the hoops you fellows have to jump through. Really incredible.

The only time I've had to join a club to buy a weapon was when buying from the Civilian Marksmanship Program. And that was accomplished online with what must be a gold mine of a money maker called the Garand Collectors Association.

As you have no doubt found out by reading the various gun sites, no license other than identification and an instant background check is needed to actually buy a weapon in most of the US. For the milsurp collector, a Curio and Relic license can be had without any problem for adults with no criminal or mental problem history. No medical certificate. No references. No police inspection of the home, although with the license the chief law enforcement officer has to be notified. ( This is largely so that a record can be kept so that if a police officer or fireman is called to your residence they will know what they may be facing.) No restriction on numbers of guns. No ammo restrictions. Guns can be ordered and delivered to your door, like the daily newspaper.

But, all the above being said.... the present state of affairs is something that will probably change sooner or later. As long as we have congressmen with time on their hands the odds are they will think up ways to restrict our otherwise freedom for our own good, as they perceive it. Particularly when some nut or other goes on a rampage and murders a bunch of people they don't even know.

Although not posing any problem, if you want to apply for Cat 1 or Cat 4 permits the club will, usually once a year, hold an 'exam' which I don't think ANYONE fails - which covers their backside, ie. You passed so you are fit to have a gun!! I took the exam last year so it was done with. It's a multiple choice question test so EASY!!

There is also a requirement that the club assesses each member 3 times a year to make sure they are still OK to hold certificates. This entails asking the secretary to sign and stamp your record card for you when you visit the range. You spread the stamp out over the year to make it look good.

After reading what you go through in other countries to own firearms, I am almost (but not quite) embarrassed to post gun laws in Arizona, probably one of the most lenient states. When I first moved here from California, couldn't believe it said "No Firearms" on the door of the bank, DUH, now I know why. If a business has "No firearms" posted on the door, you can't take them in, otherwise go for it. However, I don't see as many people with guns as I did 10 years ago.

Vern.

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Arizona State Requirements

*Rifles and Shotguns*

* Permit to purchase rifles and shotguns? No

* Registration of rifles and shotguns? No

* Licensing of owners of rifles and shotguns? No

* Permit to carry rifles and shotguns? No

*Handguns*

* Permit to purchase handgun? No

* Registration of handguns? No

* Licensing of owners of handguns? No

* Permit to carry concealed handguns? Yes

*Other Requirements*

* Is there a State waiting period? No

* Is there a FBI *NICS check for firearm transactions? Yes (None for private deals)

* Permit to carry a concealed weapon required? Yes

* Record of sale: No

*NICS - National Instant Check System

No limit on assault style (semi-auto) rifles or magazine capacity.

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*ARIZONA FIREARM LAWS*

Arizona is a '*Right to Open Carry' *state with the following restrictions:

If you carry a gun on your person and you don’t have a concealed weapon

permit, the weapon must be at least partially visible or in a holster or case that is partially visible.

*Concealed Weapon Permit*

A permit to carry a concealed weapon is available to anyone who can meet the state of Arizona’s criteria. You will be issued a concealed weapon permit if you:

*

Are residents of Arizona

*

At least 21 years of age

*

Are not a convicted felon in any jurisdiction

*

Do not suffer from any mental illness

*

Are not an illegal alien

*

Pass a 8-hour Department of Public Safety

approved firearms safety-training program that meets the

minimum DPS (Dept of Public Safety) requirements.

*

The "qualification" consists of a minimum of 5 rounds fired

at 5 yards and 5 rounds fired at 10 yards. A minimum score of 70% is required. To count, the rounds must fall within the secondary scoring rings of a TQ-15 target or its equivalent.

The permit is $65 and the class is around $60 to $100.

You probably would get arrested if you carried a firearm around in plan view on the street. However a concealed carry permit can be gotten with a few bucks to the local sheriff. No shooting school required.

I don't have a permit to carry. I don't see the need. Just one more thing to carry around and maybe lose and if I lost my temper I might get myself in real trouble.

Had a carry permit, but rarely carried, so I didn't renew it.

Vern.

Duncan, I would go through the hoops to have an original calibre military rifle. The delays seem a pain, but the procedure does not seem insurmountable. To me, the rifle is not the same if it has been rechambered.

Regards

Peter.

I would tend to agree with you but I am not 100% sure that I could qualify for a Cat.1, being foreign and all that don't you know! To own one in 30-284W is 100% better than not owning one at all

Once I have this one under my belt I will ask some questions because I would like to add to the collection with perhaps a No:4 and a MAS36 and oh yes a Swiss and...................well you get the picture and Military calibers are cheaper. A Schmidt-Ruben K31 is about 345€ in 7.5 but 465€ in 30-284W.

The Mosin will make 3 registered rifles for me in Cat.5 and that might make it easier.

In the UK its more or less the same procedure as Ian dscribed.

Except for hand guns they are banned with up to ten year in jail if found in possesion.