Unknown origine

This is a place to post about the classic Russian bolt action rifle.

Moderator: Miller Tyme

Post Reply
User avatar
Dutch Mosin
Leading Member
Posts: 783
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 5:45 pm
Location: Netherlands

Unknown origine

Post by Dutch Mosin » Tue Sep 20, 2005 2:40 am

Some time ago I was able to buy myself an all matching Mosin Nagant Model 91/59 build on a 1933 Ishevsk hex receiver.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a191/ ... 33976d.jpg[/pic]

IMHO this is one of the most mystic Mosin Nagants there is.

Of course all Mosin Nagants have their own story, but for this carbine no proof can be found on where they were “produced”.

Some say they were ”produced” in the USSR, others state that Bulgaria cut back the 91/30 rifles.

Fact is that these weapons are 91/30 rifles cut back to the specifications of a Mosin Nagant M38.

They are called model 91/59 because of the marking that can be found on the receiver.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a191/ ... 159cpl.jpg[/pic]

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a191/ ... 9159CU.jpg[/pic]

The easiest way to recognize an M91/59 is the rear sight which is the longer M91/30 type with all graduations above 10 milled off the leaf. The M91/59 was not issued with a bayonet and will not accept the M91/30 bayonet due to it's heavier front sight base.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a191/ ... er9159.jpg[/pic]

Most models 91/59 are build on a round receiver.

Fewer are build on the hex receiver.

It is possible the USSR cut back obsolete 91/30 rifles to sell or donate them to one of their satellite countries, for example Bulgaria.

The US importer (Century Arms) stated they bought these carbines in Bulgaria, so the “selling to a satellite country theory” could be true.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a191/ ... ystamp.jpg[/pic]

However, I have never seen, heard nor read of any evidence that the USSR or Bulgaria cut back these rifles.

The fact that Century Arms bought these carbines in Bulgaria is no proof they were “produced” there.

Another possibility is that the USSR cut back the obsolete 91/30 rifles to support rebel organisations at the end of the 1950’s and this way weaken the strength of western countries.

An example for this support is the donation of weapons to Algerian rebels to support their fight against the French.

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a191/ ... endel2.jpg[/pic]

Then again, nothing is certain with this carbine and for me it stays the most mystic Mosin Nagant there is.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin
User avatar
awo425
Leading Member
Posts: 453
Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 3:44 pm
Location: Germany

Post by awo425 » Wed Sep 21, 2005 2:04 am

BEAUTIFULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
User avatar
lmc1016
Posts: 45
Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2005 8:40 am
Location: Texas

M91/59

Post by lmc1016 » Thu Sep 22, 2005 10:53 pm

beautiful rifle! is that a laminate stock, sure has alot of grain if not.
M. Cavanaugh, NR-P
User avatar
Dutch Mosin
Leading Member
Posts: 783
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 5:45 pm
Location: Netherlands

Stocks

Post by Dutch Mosin » Fri Sep 23, 2005 3:45 pm

Thanks AWO 425 and lmc1016

To answer your question lmc 1016, no this rifle has no laminated stock.

It must be Birch.

I remember reading somewhere that the Russians and Soviets usualy used Birch.

I think they used the laminated stocks at the end of WWII. :?:

The US stocks made at Remington and New England Westinghouse were made of American Walnut.

The French at Chatellerault made their stocks of European Walnut.

The Finns used Arctic Birch and Hungary, Poland and Romania used Beech.

Just checked on the Chinese T53 and it says Catalpa.

Don't know what kind of wood that is, but I guess it's local.

If somebody outthere has some more info on this Chinese wood, please let me know.

I sure could use the info. :!:

Here's one reason why I like the Mosin Nagant rifles and carbines.

There are always exceptions. :mrgreen:

Finland used some European Walnut, which they called "nut wood", purchased from Germany.

A lot of Finnish stocks are from captured or purchased Russian rifles, including US rifles with Walnut stocks. During refurbishment many rifles were placed in stocks from other sources and will not follow the above guidelines.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin
User avatar
awo425
Leading Member
Posts: 453
Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 3:44 pm
Location: Germany

Post by awo425 » Sat Sep 24, 2005 2:15 am

The russians also used beech wood in some cases. My M91/38 is stocked in a russian beech M44 stock.

Can you post a closer pic of the grain?

Maybe we can figure out, what wood is is.

My B barreled M91 is stocked in german nut wood, maybe the P26 too, got to look, too many rifle to remember :mrgreen:

Chris
Post Reply