THE FIRST WORLD WAR as reported in the daily news

[Niner]

Battle of Jutland between British and German ships is noticed in the US but the who won part is hard to determine. Both sides seem to think it was a victory even though both sides lost significant numbers of ships and men.

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[Niner Delta]

From what I have read about this battle, it seems that Germany won the battle in that England
lost more ships and men, but England won in the long terms as the German fleet never left port
in force again. The article speaks of England losing 5000 men, well that was just a couple of hours
of battle on the Western Front, on some days.......


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[DuncaninFrance]

I was watching a documentary on the battle last week and the reason for the greater number of British ships lost was confirmed as being a demand for faster shooting than the Germans. To assist this some of the cordite explosive bags that are necessary to launch the shell on its way were stored in the turrets and not in the magazines.
This was responsible to the large explosions which sank many British ships during the battle as cordite burns at a hell of a rate and when confined produces terrific pressures. A cordite fire in a turret would move rapidly down to the magazine as the protective doors would have been held open to allow the swift passage of cordite to the guns.
The fact that many German ships were repeatedly hit but did not sink was also considered and a wave tank test of a model of HMS Queen Mary with the same amount of damage as the SMS Seydlitz , hit by twenty-one main calibre shells, several secondary calibre and one torpedo.
Applying the same amount of water as the German ship and maintaining watertight bulkheads the Queen Mary also floated. It was thought that the British ships had a design fault but this test disproves that.
The presenters also visited the only remaining Dreadnought - USS Texas, to allow them to consider at first hand the theories that they had put forward.
Casualties;

BRITISH
6,094 killed
674 wounded
177 captured
3 battlecruisers
3 armoured cruisers
8 destroyers
(113,300 tons sunk)

GERMAN
2,551 killed
507 wounded
1 battlecruiser
1 pre-dreadnought
4 light cruisers
5 torpedo-boats
(62,300 tons sunk)


The reason it was considered a British Victory was because the German High Seas Fleet fled back to Wilhelmshaven and did not venture out again during the war.

[Niner Delta]

It seems it was a British victory in retrospect, as at the time, the British didn't know that
the German fleet would not leave port for the rest of the 2.5 years of the war that remained.

And you are saying that the British crews caused many of their own problems by improper storage
of powder bags and not closing magazine doors and watertight doors. I'll bet that information was
not made public at the time, or even for a long time after.......


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[DuncaninFrance]

It seems it was a British victory in retrospect

Although the Royal Navy lost more ships and men they were still the larger of the 2 fleets by far and it was the German fleet that retired to port.
Another point that is worth considering is the fact that British Naval Intelligence was able to monitor the German Navy around the world and therefore had a good idea of it's threat level at the time - Room 40.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_40

[Niner]

A notion that didn't succeed then and now days wouldn't get much approval either. In the land of the free and the home of the brave they thought this kind of thing was a good idea..... how would you liked to have been facing turning 18 and being pressed into involuntary military servitude without pay for six months when there wasn't even a war to fight? Yet.

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[DuncaninFrance]

Interesting article

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06 ... o-history/

[DuncaninFrance]

Today, along with many others. I remember the fallen of the Battle of The Somme.
May they rest in eternal peace...........

[Niner]

"Day of glory".... in the newspaper. Lots of Glory.

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[Niner]

Meanwhile back at the ranch... the US and Mexico are heating things up. President Wilson calls on national guard units to go to Mexico to teach those pesky Mexicans a lesson. Then today a hundred years ago... the Mexicans do the "No Mas" thing it is all but a done don't hurt me deal without the bloodshed. However the "Fighting 69th New York regiment".. mostly Irish, had gotten a lot of press because they wanted to go to the exciting adventure but had been overlooked in favor of state troops closer to the scene of the potential action. HOwever.. the same day as all the excitement was looking like it had had the fire put out under it... the "fighting 69th" was given it's marching orders.

The "Fighting 69th" was a movie with James Cagney about the Regiment fighting in WWI after the US got into it. One would have thought they had won the "fighting" appellation because of something they did in WWI. But they professed it before they had ever fired a shot.

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