Trafalgar meeting

PeterN2 · Post by **PeterN2** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 5:14 pm

I went to the Trafalgar Meeting at the weekend at Bisley. We went down on friday and came back on monday. The weather was a bit dull and threatened rain at times but it stayed fine and was warm for the time of year. I spent most of the time at the 200 yard firing line on Century range as I was shooting there on saturday and sunday morning and sharing the RO job in the afternoons.

A view of century range. We were by the white tent on the far side.

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The cannon was fired to start each session of shooting in the morning and afternoon.

A detail in progress.

A couple of Enfields firing the mad minute.

A pair of black powder shooters firing the mad minute.

I think this was an Enforcer on McQueens, not an Envoy.

John, one of our party, after his shoot with his thutty-thutty Win 94.

The Single Shot Black Powder Cartridge Rile Club were there shooting for group. The winner had a group size of two and a bit inches for five shots at 200 yards.

Standing at 200 yards with the BSA .310 Cadet.

Shooting black powder rifle standing.

This fellow dressed for the part.

A Finnish Nagent on the Snaps.

Martini-Henry on the Snaps.

Swedish Mauser on Snaps with rapid behind.

Some old bald geezer shooting rapid with his M96 Swedish Mauser, oh! That is me.

A lady shooting on McQueens. She is looking to join a club in the North East of England, Joseyclosey and Dromia territory. She lives in Great Ayton. We directed her to the NRA who will hopefully point her to some clubs up there. She wants outdoor longer range shooting, not indoor smallbore.

This fine old gentleman is Mr Barry Custance-Baker. He has been shooting at Bisley for 74 years. He first shot there as a schoolboy in 1931. He is now 90 years old. He told me that he can't see quite as well as he used to, but will carry on as long as he can. He can still shoot very well though and won his Match two years ago. He was still putting in bulls and inners when I sneaked a look at his score card. He is the only shoter I saw using the back position.

At his loading table.

Taking the shot. He has a strap on his wrist with a rubber ring attached. He clamps this rubber ring between his teeth to hold his head in position.

Leaving the range after his shoot.

Blackpowder rapid and target.

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There were some funny black rifles being fired by a group of shooters to our left. These are the manually operated AR15 clones. One fellow bucked the trend and was the lone Enfield shooter among them.

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Two of my companions on RO duty.

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Monday morning and packing up to go home. It had started to rain now, for once it waited until after the shooting.

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It rained most of the 200 odd miles home. For those of you that drive on the wrong side of the road, I am in the passenger seat and not taking picures whilst driving.

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All in all a good weekend. I bought a few bits and bobs but nothing significant. I never saw Adam but I presume he was there somewhere.I hope to do it all again next year.

Regards

Peter.

Strangely_Brown · Post by **Strangely_Brown** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 5:56 pm

Thank you Peter!

I least I now know what I missed.

It was good to the picture of Mr Cunstance-Baker although I didn't realise that he was that old, good for him. We shall miss his generation when their all gone.

As some of you know I missed the Trafalgar this year because Mrs Strangely Brown has had another operation and I have had to nurse her for a few days after she came out of hospitable; well I am pleased to say she is getting stonger by the day and by next week I hope to have her getting some exercise with my reloading press!

For those of you with easy access to Bisley there is a firework display this Saturday 29th October at 7.00 pm, I intend to take Mrs SB up for it and have supper in one of the club houses. It is (apparently) the four hundredth anniversary of the gun powder plot this year and the fireworks will be the biggest display that Bisley has ever seen.

Apart from the time that some pratt loaded his Remington Rolling Block with pistol powder and had what we ex gunners call a premature!

Post by **Niner** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 7:00 pm

Where did that guy with the US Civil War outfit come from?

Really a mix of different kinds of firearms in the shooting events. Nothing like it in the US that I've ever been to. Good to see the pictures.

Aughnanure · Post by **Aughnanure** » Tue Oct 25, 2005 7:43 pm

Marvellous to see such a diversity of firearms being used, and to see Mr Custance-Baker is still going strong. I hope in 20 years time I'm looking as good as he.

Eoin.

dbm · Post by **dbm** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 1:17 am

Barry Custance-Baker still shoots regularly with us in MLAGB and Long Range Rifles (LRR) Branch matches, and still wins prizes. Last I spoke to him he wasn't sure about continuing with 900 and 1000 yard shooting due to eye-sight problems. He is shooting the coming weekend in a LRR 600yd match. He has also spoken several times at our annual dinner including topics as diverse as his war time experiences and the fine art of Kimono making!

His muzzle loading match rifle is home built. I don't think shooting in the back position is normally permitted at distances of 600yds and less. Barry has dispensation to do so through from the NRA. He says he can take any amount of recoil in the back position but wouldn't be able to shoot prone.

He is an inspiration to us all.

David

Brian the Brit · Post by **Brian the Brit** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 2:47 am

What a superb post, Peter!

I have watched the old gentleman shooting (very successfully) from the back position on a couple of occasions and fancy having a go. With my luck though I'd probably end up with a pronounced limp.

I remember reading a report of an international match held in the USA in the 1890s (probably on the Research Press site) in which it was claimed that the American team's use of the back position gave them the crucial advantage over the British team who were all shooting prone.

I wonder why the position died out after the muzzle-loading era? Something to do with the length of the cartridge rifles that followed? Can anyone enlighten me further?

Brian

bradtx · Post by **bradtx** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 8:27 am

Peter, Echoing, Brian, simply supurb. The diversity of shooters and arms is tremendous to see.

Mr Cunstance-Baker, certainly doesn't look his age and unfortunately negates my ageing eyesight excuse!

The only time I've seen the back position is in a slightly modified form for the silhouette shooters.

Thanks, Brad

PeterN2 · Post by **PeterN2** » Wed Oct 26, 2005 5:49 pm

Thanks for the compliments.

Niner, I don't know where the US Civil War shooter was from as I didn't get to speak to him, but I assume he was British as I didn't hear any American accents. There was a group of shooters from Germany attending. They took away some trophies with them. They come over every year to have a good time shooting and then drinking lots of beer.

A picture of a scoped Swedish M96 rifle that I missed last time.

Regards

Peter

dbm · Post by **dbm** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 12:57 am

Re. the back position......

Brian the Brit wrote:I wonder why the position died out after the muzzle-loading era? Something to do with the length of the cartridge rifles that followed? Can anyone enlighten me further?

The position did not die out after the muzzle loading and was used well inot the breech loading era amongst match rifle shooters.

The back position became popular (and essential) in the 1870s. Lt. Col. Peel, the adjutant to the British team, in 1877 in his report to the NRA(GB) following the American victory at Creedmoor attributed some of the British failure to the use of the prone position.

What needs to be remembered is at that time no artificial support was permitted ... including a sling ... and no sighters were allowed. The various forms of back position developed as a means of obtaining the most stable position.

I'm not sure when the sling was permitted for target rifle comps. but that will have had some impact in the demise of the back position. It is still seen today amongst some NRA match rifle shooters and it is used by three of the regulars who compete in MLAGB long range competitions.

David

belgmart · Post by **belgmart** » Thu Oct 27, 2005 11:57 am

I normally try to be there too, but this time it was not to be, as I had to work...

The Trafalgar, weather permitting, is one of the best meets I have ever done, with shooting from 25 yds gallery all the way out to 900yds Long Range shooting.

All the best to those of you who were there, and I would have liked to be there too - unfortunately it was not to be